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WotL OOC Thread

This 2E Dragonlance game is set in the city of Haven, during the War of the Lance. Haven is a city undergoing great upheaval. First massive numbers of refugees pour in, then the city is conquered by a draconic army. Can our heroes survive under this dark occupation?

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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by JadedDM »

If you are literally going to bring ALL of them, plus the ranger, plus the five party members, I probably wouldn't even bother playing out the fight; it'd be complete overkill. I mean, that's not a party. That's a small but potent army. Your success is guaranteed, but the rewards are paltry. The hill giant, worth 3,000 XP, would give the whole group 20 XP each after being divided between the 131 of you. Each of you might get a couple of copper pieces, assuming the giant has any treasure.

I imagine, after having organized such a powerful group for the cultists, they could then easily take the city without any trouble, too. So I'm sure Darewind will be quite pleased. He won't need any bards, you have organized an army for him instead. :mrgreen:

Regarding the bit about 'the party being good' I'll point out that Tulbas, Haahqae and Gregeddin are actually all Neutral. Darga and Kendra are in the minority, and Kendra acts more LN than NG anyway.

But anyway, what do the rest of you think of Tulbas' plan? If everyone agrees, we'll go with that one.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by djhyland »

As a player, I'd of course rather have some gold and experience for my character. However, Darga's not the brave sort, and he'd support more combatants as opposed to less. He'll devise and rig up whatever traps he can (perhaps the army can lure the giant to somewhere Darga can engineer a rockfall or something?), but he wants the risk spread out as thinly as possible.

Darga will, however, express his concern that if an army of cultists successfully fights together to defeat the giant, they might realize that given their success, taking over the town is also a likely endeavor.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by Haahque »

Haahqae on the other hand is both brave and foolish. He'd rather take a much smaller party to fight the giant. He might also underestimate it a bit due to reasons he's mentioned before.

I see no reason to take 1st level characters when 3rd level characters take the same amount of xp/loot. Therefore let's take a bunch of 3rd levels.

Let's take the Huntsman because he gave us the quest, he knows the giant's actions the most and we can always use a good 5th level ranger to soften it off at long range. Also if he knows a lot about the terrain, he'd be ideal for knowing best how to set up traps.

Haahqae's all for recruiting the gnome and sharing stories of Mt. Nevermind while they wait for the giant.

Clerics sound pretty useless without divine powers, but it might be nice to have one to talk to to find out more about Fistindillus.

I don't know everything about the thief's backstab, but I'm sure even if we were able to pull it off (which we probably could) it would only work once, so it'd probably be better to bring fighters who can do more consistent damage then thieves.

So my suggestion is that we bring 2 level 5s (3x xp), 2 level 3s (2x xp) + 5 party members (5x xp) means we'd split the xp by 10, for 300 xp each.

Of the 4 people we bring, one's the huntsman. It'd be nice if one was the gnome, which we should probably make an illusionist (gnomes can only be thief or illusionist?). Then we could bring along 2 level 3 fighters for muscle, thus it'd probably be best to pick up a half-ogre and a dwarf.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by JadedDM »

If we go with Tulbas' plan, traps aren't even necessary. Sending 131 men and women to kill one monster is full overkill. Even if half of the army misses their attack, the giant will probably go down in the first round before it even gets its turn.

On the other hand, if we go with Haahqae's plan, then traps would be much more useful. But it depends on what kind of traps you want to build, of course. Any trap set for a 16' foot being will require lots of manpower and hours, or even days to build.

For a thief's backstab to work, you have to be able to reach the opponent's vital organs. This could prove tricky for a 16' tall being, and as Haahqae points out, you'd only be able to do it once anyway.

In 2E, gnomes can be fighters, thieves, illusionists, fighter/illusionists, illusionist/thieves or fighter/thieves. However, in my games, any race can be any class and that applies to NPCs as well as PCs.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by HorizonsDream »

Taking all 131 seems a bit of an overkill for a giant in my opinion.

Anyway, as for what Kendra is going to do for the next three days.
I know that she is going to want to catch up with the rest of the group at some point. Plus, she has to ask them to help her out with a quest she just got from the thieves guild. Providing that she does catch up with everyone before they got giant hunting, she'll join them on that mission. On the third day, providing she isn't too injured still, she'll finally go back to work.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by djhyland »

Darga will certainly be interested in the thieves' guild for his own purposes...
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by BishGada »

I say lets have this army and start conquering the continent :)

Let's at least have 7lvl mage and 5/6 th lvl fighter.

About the 18th. Tulbas will check upon the healer for more suggestion and if there will be a change in Raetmal condition he will obviously react.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

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BishGada wrote:I say lets have this army and start conquering the continent :)
I think someone might have already had that idea and beat you to the punch.

So Haahqae wants to bring the huntsman (5th level ranger), a 5th level gnome illusionist, a 3rd level dwarf fighter and a 3rd level half-ogre fighter.

Tulbas wants to bring a 7th level mage and a 6th level fighter.

So I can flesh out those six people and let the party meet them, interview them, and then decide who to bring and who to leave behind. Sound good?
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by djhyland »

Sounds good to me.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by mgbevan »

From a role playing perspective, Gregeddin would probably prefer there to be more lower level combatants, leaving the party with more of the glory / using his rallying songs etc. However, if loads of people were slaughtered it wouldn't make for a very good tale, so taking the higher level NPCs as suggested is also workable with character. (And preferred from a gameplay perspective I think)
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by HorizonsDream »

I'm with the rest of the group on this one. Only taking a few of the higher level people to help out with the giant works. Plus, you don't want to help the cult build an army to take over Haven.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by JadedDM »

Alright then. I've already started work on the XP for chapter four; it may take longer than normal because I've been really slammed at work. I'm hoping to get chapter five up by tomorrow, if all possible.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by mgbevan »

Cool, thanks Jaded.
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by JadedDM »

Okay, XP is up. No level ups this time, but you guys all came rather close.

Here are my notes on the last chapter:

Raetmal's Departure and Return
I hadn't considered the possibility of Tulbas insisting so strongly that Kynaston and Daxia not leave until Raetmal returns. The whole scenario with Raetmal was me constantly plugging up leaks on a ship that kept sinking. It's actually kind of funny, in retrospect.

I'll explain. This all started when Tulbas decided to return to his uncle's shop to borrow magic items for the Ergothian battle. I realized right away this was not a great scenario for me. I couldn't reasonably come up with a justification for why Raetmal would turn him down; he is his nephew, after all. On the other hand, I saw this as the beginning of a troubling trend. If the party can just load up on magical items before every fight, there's no real challenge.

So I decided a quick and easy fix would be to just not have Raetmal be there. He was called away on urgent business and will return the following day. And all of the magic items are locked away in the back, where Tulbas can't get to them. There, problem solved. Or so I thought!

Then Tulbas insisted that Kynaston and Daxia wait for his uncle's return, so he can just whisk Daxia away to the Tower. This was even more of a problem! The whole point of Daxia leaving the city was to take Kynaston with her. He was an abandoned PC, and I wanted to get rid of him. Thus, escorting Daxia to the Tower of Wayreth was a perfect excuse. But if Raetmal could just take her there in a snap, there was no reason for Kynaston to go along (indeed, he could not go, as a non-mage would not be allowed in the Tower). Okay, so I decided they would just be very insistent on leaving before Raetmal came back. No problem, right?

However, Tulbas would not back down. I wasn't worried at first, because it's not like he could physically restrain them or anything. But then I was thrown another unexpected punch. Tulbas decided to go with them! Now, understand, this is a sandbox game and the players can do whatever they want. If one of you wants to leave the party on a solo quest, you absolutely can. That was not the problem. The problem was Kynaston. I was trying to get rid of him. If Tulbas went with him...then I'd have to continue playing him.

I realized I needed to think of a way to make Tulbas stay behind in a way that would fit his character. In other words, I didn't want to just say, "No, you can't roleplay your character like that, he stays home." I wanted it to be HIS choice, not mine. So I had Raetmal reappear nearby, severly wounded, hoping that Tulbas would be too distracted to continue following them. It worked. Tulbas' attention was redirected and Kynaston and Daxia were able to leave the city.

The tricky part was tying it all together. Why was Raetmal wounded? Who wounded him? What did he mean when he said 'they' were coming? What's the deal with that spooky Black Robe who keeps poking his nose around? I managed to tie it altogether, and hopefully it will be revealed soon.

Just a little peek of the behind the scenes string pulling that goes on in a typical game.

Thief vs. Thief
I think when Darga saw the woman who stole from him, I figured he'd try and tail her or something. I didn't expect him to confront her. I reasoned she would think that anyone who carries that much money probably isn't a completely upright citizen and so she called his bluff by calling for the guards herself. I'm curious to see what he does next to deal with this situation and get his coin back, assuming it hasn't all been spent yet!

Masked Dragon Inn
When Gregeddin visited the Masked Dragon Inn, there were several people (or groups of people) sitting at various tables at the inn. Each one was a potential plot hook, except the robed monks which were more for flavor of the metaplot of the setting (the titular War of the Lance). Gregeddin only discovered the quest of the fake potion sellers. I won't yet reveal what the other quests were, in case I can bring them up again at a later date--save one. The shady looking people in leather armor who came in toward the end were part of Necolai's gang. It was possible Gregeddin could have activated that quest instead of Kendra, had he engaged them.

References
At one point Darga overhears a kender talking about how his uncle was turned into a squirrel by a wizard and a girl squirrel fell in love with him. This was a reference to Disney's Sword in the Stone. When another kender asked if the uncle was still a squirrel, he was told, no, he 'got better.' This was a reference to Monty Python's Holy Grail.

Kendra and Norris
Geez, reading over it again, the conversation Kendra and Norris have about rioters and protesters seems very strangely reminiscent of what is happening in the US right now. One might think I was directly referencing Ferguson, but the whole conversation actually started a month prior to the Grand Jury's decision. A really weird coincidence, actually.

Their discussion about the wedding and the honeymoon is actually pretty sad, if you pay attention to Norris' reactions. He starts out quite happy, but the more Kendra craps on the whole thing, the more she brings him down. She claims she doesn't care where the honeymoon is, wonders if the wedding will be time-consuming, and then claims she had no part of the planning process at all (which wasn't true). So when Norris tries to give her more control, hoping to see her the least bit enthusiastic about their wedding, she shrugs it off as if she doesn't care anyway.

Darewind's Back!
Everybody sort of forgot about Darewind. I had decided that he would escape prison five days after his arrest. If you recall, Kendra had volunteered to take guard duty so she could keep an eye on him, but she never followed through on it. I had planned several scenes between the two while he was in prison, where he would reveal parts of his grand plan and foreshadow his eventual escape, but alas, they never came to be. Ironically, Kendra is still unaware that he's escaped at this point.

The Cult Grows Stronger
I can't help but appreciate the irony that the party has continued to help the Cult of the Master become more influential and powerful. First Tulbas helps them capture Daxia, who they turn over to the Ergothians for a huge cash reward which helps finance their operations considerably. Granted, he only did so to 'infiltrate' them and earn their trust and he helped rescue her after the fact. But despite this, he actually did a huge favor to the cultists. And now that he has their trust, he has yet to actually do anything with it.

Then he decides to include the cultists with the giant job. Now when the giant is slain, the cultists will get the credit which will swell their influence and earn them new members, causing them to grow even more powerful. Indeed, Tulbas actually wanted to organize an army for the cultists to take down the giant, an army that they could then turn upon the Seekers.

I guess at this point I'm unclear if Tulbas is actually a true believer or not. He's done more to help the cult than anyone else so far. :P

Necolai and his Men
I've been wanting to introduce the thief's guild for some time now. They are going to play a big role later on in the game. Although I have to admit, of everyone in the party, I would have never guessed Kendra would be the one to make contact with them.

I hope to have Chapter 5 up tomorrow after work. In the meantime, if anyone has any questions, comments or feedback of any kind, please let me know. I hope everyone is still enjoying themselves. I have some big things in store for the upcoming Summer's End (the autumnal equinox and the beginning of the harvest season, i.e., Autumn Harvest the 21st).
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Re: WotL OOC Thread

Post by BishGada »

Hi all.

First I want to say that each chapter I'm waiting for the excitement to run down but it never does!
I think the role-playing, the conversations and the depth of intrigue and details are amazing!

About having a glory tale when hundreds are getting slaughtered... well, it depends how the bard describes it. I don't see how such a small obstacle prevents you from amazing story of their bravery, falling wave after wave and still going on even that they know they are doomed, only to save the fair lady that will secure their future. (Bards obviously invent imaginary characters and tales to improve the overall story!) :)

I know Tulbas gives you some hard time and insists on some details. Especially with Daxia and Kynaston. I'm just trying to be true to reason, and Tulbas have a lot of it. Even now, I think Kynaston would run to help Raetmal. He met him after all... and Daxia should have jumped on the opportunity to be teleported instead of risking herself. If she didn't want to go to the tower after all it would be a different matter...

Anyway, Tulbas never was sure if Darewind is a fraud or not. He wanted to test for himself but never had the chance yet. Obviously he doesn't believe any good can come from worshiping Fistantantilus, but currently he is not sure how to work against it.

I didn't consider that building the army could turn over us. Tulbas doesn't like the Seekers either, he just don't want to see the cult riots brings down the people of the city, killing, raping, burning and robbing the miserable people of the city.
Hopefully, our party, being appreciated by Darewind, Nora, and the people that have influence in the cult, can restrain the situation.
Tulbas already tried to discuss it with Nora, maybe he will have a chance to discuss it with Darewind, to suggest a more subtle way to deal with the Seekers.

But you are right, his main attention now is on his uncle state, which in many ways tie his hands and makes every action of him a greater challenge.

So, waiting for the next adventures!
Good work everyone. I really enjoy playing with you.

BishGada.
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